Originally posted 15th April.
It’s been confirmed today that OQO is seeking a buyer. Naturally, this affects the OQO 2+ which is not likely to go into production until the financial problems are sorted out.
The company’s cash shortage could delay the delivery of Model 2+, said Bob Rosin, OQO’s senior vice president of sales and marketing told with The Wall Street Journal.
There arent any more details at this point.
Update: 23rd April. BuildYourUMPC.com send out a note on the 22nd April saying:
We have been informed that the 2+ will not be released and all pre-orders currently on file will be cancelled.
We also will not be receiving any new OQO inventory. Any remaining inventory has been discounted and posted in our Open Box/Clearance section on our website.
OQO have not responded to our requests for an official statement.
New article: http://cli.gs/h2Aj5P
Not much of a surprise.
When you sell a product at a premium price, that only very few people can afford, or are willing to buy, then your product needs to stand out. And imho it does not.
A mobile device, with limited battery life, and a +-1500$ price tag… Nobody is surprised that they have a hard time selling it.Especially when there are simulate products with a way lower price tag.
I still remember there first product years ago. Like anybody, i drooled over it. My god, a computer in handheld size. Drool… Until you see the price. Then its: “no thanks”. And they have kept there premium prices over the years and models.
Alot of noice but nothing to show for it. I shunned the OQO like I shunned the sony’s, for that reason. They dont seem aware of the competition, wich is currently utterly flattening their devices.
I mean.. 800×480 resolution? Guys? That was good, 5 years ago!
Theres smaller screened similar spec’d systems out there with higher resolution and lower pricetag. In other words, they will lose out.
In a way id be happy to see OQO eat it. It would lower the average value of a UMPC, giving the competition less of an excuse to hike their prices a bit.
I’d rather whoever buys them, has a sensible business plan – a more acceptable price and updated specs. Otherwise…
Some people never learn.
I think if it were possible for OQO to slash their prices and be(come) profitable, they would have done it. For whatever reason, they weren’t able to lower their costs.
The screen resolution is a bit of a red herring though. I’ve read as many people who think 800×480 is the right resolution for a 5″ screen as people who think 1000×600 is the right resolution for a 5″ screen. In particular, I’ve read very few complaints about the resolution of the Aigo screen. However, I may not be reading the right forums.
FWIW, the 2+ does (did?) have a more acceptable price and updated specs (relative to the 02 at least). Oh well…
I hope they find a buyer.
> I’ve read very few complaints about the resolution of the Aigo screen.
With just a 4GB of storage Aigo is a MID, not a full-featured PC. I’d expect OQO to be able to run wider variety of applications, and for that 800×480 is not enough…
Paul Allen are you listening?
FlipStart failed, but heres your chance to buy a technologically successful company thats just financially strapped.
“successful company financially strapped”
Does not compute. ;)
PUMA didn’t say “successful company.” He said “technically successful company.” i.e., they were at the vanguard of technology, certainly with respect to form factor.
good luck to whoever buys OQO.
I wish that apple buy OQO….. my dream UMPC.
It is not the price but the size and shape that really is the problem. How do most people use a full Windows computer? it is not with their thumbs and that is the key issue. Since most people do not find it ideal nor comfortable to much input with their thumbs then most OQO owners probably have multiple computers. People do want a pocket laptop but most would want it to just work the same way as a normal computer so that means touch type input and they are likely not to own another computer.
That is why price then comes into the picture as it is expensive for something that does not have the expected input method people would expect for their sole computer.
This design has been unchanged in shape and size and it sells somewhere between 8-15 thousand units a year; that is pretty weak. They should add a second model that is about 7″ to 7.5″ long by 4″ to 4.3″ wide and about 1″ or less in height; that would provide the size needed for a good keyboard. Yes a small handheld if designed right can provide good input. Remember the Psion 5mx at only 6.9″ by 3.6″ I could type about 80% of desktop as the keys were large and easy to type on.
That is exactly why I never bought the OQO and think they should have gone out of business years ago. I am surprised they lasted this long?
Al
I copy my post in the previous note about Oqo
“If someone want a touchtype PC there are a lot o options (some almost pocketable some not) but if someone wants a trully pocketable PC there’s only the Oqo so why to look at it if size isn’t your main request?”
And I particulary don’t find it specially expensive
The entry model was $ 1200.- and we are talking about a device that leads it’s class (It’s actually my main PC while it fits in my waist)
It’s keyboard could be improved by changing it’s layout (I like the separated numeric keypad but it sacrifices a lot of space) but I don’t see too many other defects
Ssagg,
There is not one computer anywhere that has a touch type keyboard and is jacket pocket in size running full Windows available to buy. Size is important as I do want it small enough to carry in my jacket pocket so that I do not need a bag of any type to carry it, BUT having it jacket pocket is important but so is functionality. Touch type input is how everyone wants to use a full PC; thumb input is just practical for a full PC.
Voice and other options like pen input are all still not what most people want; people want a touch type keyboard. The OQO is the perfect technology to use to create a more clamshell full PC as devices in the past like the HP Jornada 720 series are still jacket pocket in size yet the current OQO technology could easily fit inside that volume of space with little modifications.
There are no clamshells that are available today with a touch type keyboard, running full Windows that will fit in a jacket pocket. Yet when handhelds were in production back in the 1990’s and even with a buggy HPC OS that was not full Windows, they still consistently sold over 2.3 million a year before MS dropped the OS. Now look at all of the UMPC’s worldwide including the OQO, in all of 2007 they only sold 350k units worldwide. That is clear proof that people do not like thumb input, pen input, etc. as there was not one computer in that UMPC market that was jacket pocket in size with a touch type keyboard. All the other variations of inputs, etc. had very weak demand and still do.
I agree with some of the people above that it is not price the real problem here. For me the reason is that MID’s are simply a redundant category. You can really have only one device in your pocket and that is your smartphone. Your smartphone has instant on, has way longer battery life and it is a way better communications device. There is no more room left in your pocket for anything else.
Next thing after your smartphone is something you will carry in a bag of some shape and form. It may be very compact, allowing plenty of space for many other items, but need not be pocketable nevetherless. Most important feature? The feature that you phone cannot accommodate, namely a usable keyboard. For content creation not just consumption. This is why MIDs are a failed category: too big to be really pocketable (running on top an OS which is inappropriate for mobile use), but also with crappy keyboards. Some gadget lovers could consider them but this is where price enters the picture and seals the case…
I concur with ssagg.. the oqo’s form factor is for people who like the oqo’s form factor.. the clamshell is for fans of that build.. You can’t just flatly state that the device will be more popular with the stated profile.. as noone really knows.
I happen to think the oQo has the best appearance and keyboard of any UPMC available, and would buy it in a heart beat if not for the known issues… clamshells im not so fond of, as i like occasionally use it with one hard with moving, and also keep it at my hip.
There are no handheld full PC computers that can fit in a jacket pocket for sale. Yet the OQO has been trying to sell their size and shape with a thumb keyboard for 8 years with pathetic sales per year. Sure current OQO owners love it but if you look at 2008 they only sold 8-15K units that is never going to be a profitable situation. There are millions whom would buy an OQO with a touch type keyboard. Remember those handhelds did sell over 2.3 million a year with a buggy OS; now if you had a computer like that which ran rull Windows like an OQO it would sell very well to a larger group of people.
John- I think MID’s and UMPC’s are failing so far because people are sheep.. they like what you tell them to like, and so far the masses are used to larger portables.
However just look at the netbook craze.. do we really need a redesigned pentium 3 in our bags that can probably fit a more powerful notebook of slightly larger proportions.. i sure dont.. but boy x thinks he needs one because his friend has one.. and so on and so on.
PrinceGQ I don’t agree with the idea that people are sheep and cannot judge for themselves. It is more likely that our criteria are too crude to capture important aspects of reality – aspects which usually do not find a place on the feature list that marketing departments write down for us. For example “usability”.
Would any student sit down in class and take notes on an OQO or any other UMPC for that matter? How many would be willing to write their reports or a lengthy email when sitting on Starbucks on such a device? How many would be willing to do so after a month or two when the novelty aspect of using such a thing has worn out? I know I would do all such things on a Vaio P easily, even tough the P has almost the same volume and weight. Even though it is expensive, it is useful. That’s why the P is backordered in many countries while OQO is seeking a buyer… It is not because people are sheep, but rather because they have criteria that we often fail to quantify.
Now, I am not saying that MIDs/umpcs are useless for all. There is a niche market for sure but precisely because it is niche, it is a bad idea to base your whole product portfolio on it. In most cases however, I believe that most mobile computing scenarios outside the realm of smartphones involve a usable keyboard. Simple as that :)
I think the question is how badly do you want the device to fit within your pocket. Sony’s ads not withstanding, I doubt many people would actually walk around with a Viao P in their pocket. Only if it truly doesn’t matter one way or the other whether the device fits in a pocket or not does it make sense to compare a Viao P with an OQO.
For the record, the Viao P is twice the volume of the OQO and ~40% heavier. This shouldn’t be surprising. The Viao P has more than twice the surface area but it is 0.8in thick as opposed to 1in for an OQO. It’s not the same volume in a different shape. It’s more or less two OQOs placed side by side.
I suspect you think of them as having “almost the same volume and weight” because the Viao P is small enough and light enough for your needs. That the OQO is yet smaller and lighter is not an advantage. Given that the OQO has a thumbboard rather than a keyboard and only a 5″ inch screen, that it’s yet smaller may even be a disadvantage for you.
As you said, the OQO is targeted at a niche market. It is for the person who wants a laptop that he can put in his pant pocket. (I borrowed a Model 02 for a week. Yes, it really does fit comfortably in a pant pocket, a pair of jeans even. It’s about as visible as a thick wallet.) How many people is that? Apparently, not enough.
Everyone else, of course, can find something that’s either cheaper or more useful for their needs. Literally, one size does not fit all.
I do suspect the situation would be different if the handwriting recognition experience and the pen experience in Windows were more fluent, especially back when Microsoft had first introduced XP Tablet. If say, by 2005, we had had rock solid handwriting recognition and a UI where the pen wasn’t just a substitute for a mouse, that would have freed many computing scenarios from requiring a usable keyboard.
There are a few third party handwriting recognizers that also do the sort of gestural recognition you need for text editing. However, if Windows by itself had had a fluent experience, we might have become accustomed to this as a plausible way of entering text. (After all, there’s nothing inherently natural about a keyboard except that we’re used to it.) However, that was not to be…
I would say a lot of people want an OQO, but the price is too high compared to what will do the job.
Handwritting and pen input is still not what most people would consider easier nor more desirable that a touch type keyboard. None of the tablets, pen PC computers, thumb input PC’s have ever had big sales compared to what everyone wants which is a full PC with a touch type keyboard.
To me the OQO could be profitable and do well if they took their technology and made it into a longer clamshell so that a touch type keyboard would be built in. Without that change they stand no chance to survive the small market of thumb computers with many competitors having the same basic size/shape and input at half the price. There is a much larger market for a true pocket laptop but it must have touch type keyboard input.
Handwriting and pen input? Isnt this the computer age? That chickenscratching was interesting when they invented paper, I woulnd care 2 bits for it on any computer to be honest.
And for making the OQO a bigger clamshell, that ll only give them an excuse to make it more expencive. :’) It would also lose its appeal as truely pocketable if you ask me, if it gets to be UMID M1 proportions.
What OQO needs, is to start getting with the rest of the gang. Wich means a 1024×600 screen and a more reasonable price around 800 bucks.
The display is not as key as the input. Look they have had 8 years to sell the same computer and in 2008 they sold 8-15k that is pathetic. Their technology is great as it is a very powerful PC that is tiny. Sure OQO existing owner might not like a slightly larger jacket pocket version but the market for a touch type pocket computer drawfs the current demand for the thumb based OQO.
With the increasing options very much the same size as the OQO at half the price there is no way they can make a viable business model to show a profit without addressing the touch type keyboard so that they can move out of a shrinking tiny niche market and open up sales potential to the millions of business users whom would buy one if they could have a touch type keyboard so that the PC could be their only computer they need to do work.
This is bad for OQO. It’s like most mention, the price for the devices was just way out for most people. I was going to purchase a OQO, but got the Sony P instead.
I wanted to buy the OQO 2+ on friday, but with what is going own, can some pls tell the best UMPC in the market so far. Will be using it for school, work, media player, gps and to also make calls.
I have seen a lot and am so confused so can someone plssss help me.
Thanks. :)
As someone who actually saved up and bought an OQO 02 when it first came out 2 years ago, I have to say that nothing out at the moment or ‘due’ out comes anywhere close to this little beast. Mine is held together with black tape and the screen is a yellow/green colour but I still use it every day.
I’ve already started saving for the 2+ but that’s not looking good for launch.
How did you draw this conclusion? Have you tried several other UMPC’s yourself?
Yes, I have. I also read and analyse online reviews and videos (and ask questions) in the search of a possible replacement.
I agree with John – most mobile computing scenarios outside of a smartphone involve the use of a keyboard.
I agree as well a smart phone has instant on, can do simple computer functions and that is where a thumb keyboard is ok to keep it ultra small. Once you want to some true work with a computer you need to be able to type not try to use two fingers and spend hours to enter information at that point you might as well go totally old school and use pen and paper.
What good is an OQO since it has no keyboard?
For the longest time, I have been hoping that OQO will add voice capabilities to its models. As someone already said, people carry their smartphone in their pocket, and OQO’s aim should be the high-end alternative to smartphones.
For a small company like OQO, unfortunately, it doesn’t have the resource to accomplish that.
I think Smartphones have been squeezing OQO out of the market. When i got my iphone, I stopped using my OQO because it was too slow to boot up in compariosn.
They lasted as long as their batteries,lol.
Guess I’m glad I didn’t order one, but I still want one and
have been waiting awhile for it. Talked to them 3 months ago
asking when it would be out and I thought it was going to
be out soon. Sure hope they don’t drop it?
Plenty of viable alternatives. ;)
It depends. If you want a pocket sized device that runs Windows out of the box, there are no other alternatives until Aigo comes out with the Windows version of their device. (Granted, this is supposed to be any day now.) The Aigo is a little longer than the OQO, but I assume it’s still pocket sized.
If you don’t need a pocket sized device, then arguably, the OQO was likely not the right device for you in the first place. In that case, there are lots of netbooks and subnotebooks to choose from.
Likewise, if you don’t need to run Windows, there are lots of pocket sized devices available. Again though, the OQO was likely not the right device for you in that case.
The UMID M1 is very comparable in size to the oqo.
And it runs faster and quieter and has a higher resolution screen
Scoobie is right the M1 is about the same size as the OQO. It looks decieving as it appears from pictures to be a handheld but it is way to short to ever provide touch type input.
That is what OQO needs to do is to get out of that shrinking weak market and focus on using their more powerful PC but provide the touch type keyboard input that the millions of business users must have to ever consider buying one.
Like Scoobie says, The M1 is par OQO on all fronts. Its roughly the same size, and the OQOs are also no match for the M1’s screen resolution. The OQO can be used as a slate computer, but does that really warrant a stiff 200 bucks is what Im wondering. I guess the fact that the M1 is packing a proper keyboard that allows you to type any way you fancy, is canceling out the slider action the OQO has going.
Its low screen resolution and apparently hidious battery life is making it look a bit mediocre at a price it cant afford. And even if price was no option, id still pick something other then the OQO.
The title of this article seems to have a rather sad double meaning. ;)
The M1 is not comparable to Oqo in size
It’s half an inch wider and more than that longer and when we are talking about extreme portability this is a lot
As ssagg points out, the M1 is .5in wider and .7in longer. (It is, however, .25in thinner.) The larger surface area makes it unlikely to fit properly in a jean pocket. Like I said, the OQO does, but it’s a close fit. I’m worried that even the Aigo may not be truly pocket sized. Again, you find it comparable in size most likely because the difference in size doesn’t matter to you. This market segment is full of devices that don’t quite fit in my pocket.
While the M1 may run quieter, I doubt it runs faster than a 2+. They have the same graphics chipset but the 2+ has a faster Atom than the M1. (The M1 also has less memory than the 2+, for those that care.)
This isn’t to say that the M1 isn’t a fine machine. I’m sure it is. (For one thing, it stands a better chance of actually being available.) It may even be a better choice for most people. (After all, there is a reason why OQO is having financial difficulties.) However, if we’re talking about the one plausible reason why anyone truly needs an OQO, then the M1 probably isn’t a substitute.
(Now I’m curious to mock it up to see if it’d fit in my pocket. I suspect the extra length and width will doom it. Like I said, the OQO is a tight fit as it is. That the M1 is thinner is appealing, but the shape is as important as total volume. There is a reason why the OQO has exactly the same surface area as a Moleskine pocket notebook.)
I find it amusing that Sokonomi thinks that the M1 has a “proper keyboard” while Al thinks it’s “way to [sic] short to ever provide touch type input.” I agree with Al. At 6.2″ wide and their keyboard layout, even if it has near standard sized keys, the spacing will be completely different. (It’s the same reason why I find typing on the 7″ Eee frustrating.)
Again, this doesn’t mean it isn’t a great machine. It’s a matter of expectations, needs and wants. (In the case of the OQO, it’s probably irreplaceable within a very specific niche. It just happens to be a niche with few customers.)
I also think this whole touch type thing is a bit crooked. You eighter want pocketable, or you want touchtypable. ;) Try both and you get an awkward little bugger like the Sony Vaio P. In my opinion, devices like that are neighter pocketable (unless you are Hagrid) or touch typable. Like a minicooper on truck tires.
If you want true mobility, you’re going to have to sacrefice some desktop functionality. ;)
I guess you never used a Psion 5mx? It is possible to design a touch type keyboard in a small enough size computer to provide an easy to carry jacket pocket size yet still type reasonably. I could type about 80-85% of desktop keyboards with a little practice on a 5mx at that was only 6.9″ long by 3.6″; now imagine a modern version that was say 7″ or even up to 7.5″ by 4″ to 4.3″ wide? that would be an incredible touch typing computer still able to be carried in a jacket pocket.
The Sony P is just a bit too long and wide. If the lenght was shorted to say 7.5″ and the width just slightly as most jacket pockets have a hard time at 4.5″ so just a tad less say 4.3 would make a world of difference.
Sure a pocket touch type keyboard laptop will require some sacrafice but today it is finally possible to create one. Back in the 1990’s it was not possible; it was only OQO whom made it possible. They could still be profitable if they created such a device as they still have an edge in power and being so small but others are not far behind.
On the other hand, touch type keyboard is not a good choice for a handheld device. I find Wibrain to be a lot more comfortable for that comparing to Raon Everun Note, and Everun imho is a little bit too small on the table / lap…
Al
I hope you are not the same person that writes with the name of Primaz in Oqotalk. Your arguments are very similar.
Sorry if I’m wrong I just ‘ve been there and noted that
That is funny… as I sat here reading Al’s comments, I was thinking “this sounds very familiar… what was that guy’s name who always went on and on and on about psion-like devices and how they would sell billions and billions of umpc’s…”
and on and on….
ssag, I think you have identified the culprit.
I use my everun for reading, audio books, occasional email and web browsing on the go. I carry it with me most places. I can’t see using a micro-laptop wanna-be in the same way. Quick, one handed operation. Not with a clamshell.
Come on OQO, I am pulling for you (not, however, with the kind of money behind me that you apparently need).
Primaz…er…Al, do you even have a UMPC? Last I heard (two years ago), you were still “hunting” for the perfect one.
??? No, but I have owned both the Psion 5mx and Revo and several others during the handheld years. I do think that type of design would have been much more appealing to people. I do not see very many people wanting to try to use two fingers to try to write a report with an OQO. I think they do need to do something about the keyboard and to me the benefits of having a longer size to provide a keyboard versus the amount of people whom can not live with carring it their back pocket or larger inside coat pockets is a clear choice.
I am not Primaz, but totally agree with him.
If you do a search there was talk of using a Psion 5 case, but updating the components – screen, CPU, memory and connectivity. Seemed split between going with VIA/Atom or ARM.
I personally would be happy with either. I know you could easily fit all the components you want and all the radios and a bigger battery than most Smatphones inside the Psion (this is using ARM components), and its keyboard still hasn’t been beaten for a decade.
Not sure how well Atom would fit, but maybe VIA would fit well too.
Woulnd the screen hinge limitations completely ruin mobility though? Chippy and JKK recently shown us how awkward it is to use a netbook style MID/UMPC that doesnt fold open completely flush with the keyboard, with the UMID M1.
On the Psions monoghrome LCD the view angle wasnt very critical, but I bet nowadays it could pose a problem.
It would basicly be a tabletop device.
Oh Hai, Primaz.
I think it is about time the OQO company went out of business. The computer has not changed much since it first came out years ago. I do think a Vista computer with a thumb keyboard is pretty much a toy for people whom love computers so much that they own several. I would never buy a Vista computer if it did not have a real keyboard.
Actually, OQO had been introducing mid-life kickers every half year or so since 2007.
And, as you notice, they are (were?) planning a significant revision before they ran out of money.
Their problem is that very few people actually need a pocket sized computer that runs Vista.
yes… they all need a pocket computer with XP….
Their revisions both currently planned with their next model and all of the past revisions do not address the fundamental flaw of the lack of a touch type keyboard. I agree there are very few people interested in the OQO pocket size computer and to clarify why it is the lack of a keyboard.
There are many people whom would like to have laptop computer in their pocket. The difference would be if it had a touch type keyboard and was small enough to fit in the larger size pockets found in typical coats and business suits the computer would provide the same keyboard and layout that everyone is already used to wants.
It is not that people do not want Vista but without a keyboard the kinds of things you can do easily with an OQO are the same things you can do with a pocket pc and other smart type phone. Performing more than just viewing or very limited inputing of information might be ok with your thumbs but any other type of more demanding computer use just requires a keyboard.
Just giving the OQO a tiltable slider screen would give this thing somuch more options. Tapping out a report while it is set down on a table with its screen slightly up would probably improve its value alot. The gummy keys need a change though, they need to be atleast solid plastic with a dimple surface to type alright. I havent used one of those keyboards like the OQO before, but if its anything like my TV remote, it must be a royal pain.
Still though, asking around 1000 euros for the low end model is redicilous.
OQO needs a fresh new owner with fresh new ideas. Tweak the screen resolution and allow it to tilt up, give it a proper keyboard that allows atleast 2 finger typing, then it MIGHT be worth the price.
The basic flaw is to believe that people would want to do the kinds of work they do with a full laptop using your thumbs? That basic assumption is what has doomed OOQ since they started years ago. Updating anything in the computer without addressing that basic key assumption which is wrong will never create any demand.
People would be willing to sacrafice and use a smaller screen, not have all of the frills of large laptop, but even anticipating a tighter position with your two hands to type, people would never want to use a two fingered approach to performing PC work. They should have used a traditional handhelds clamshell design.
Those handhelds back in the 1990’s were the perfect size to carry and use. Their only flaw was nobody at that time could fit a full PC into that small cavity. Now technology can enable that but so far all of the computer companies have forgotton about the basic way we want to use a computer.
Id be perfectly happy inputting with my thumbs to be honest.. You dont type out resume’s and 10 page reports on a 5″ screen, regardless of what input youve got.
Ive played around with someones wiibrain B1 for a bit and I was quite surprised howmuch you can get done with just 2 thumbs. Ive blogged, coded and chatted for an hour without it getting unconfortable in any way. Speed is a bit slow at first but with practice im pretty confident it would get around 75% of my normal speed.
But lets be honest here, Devices as small and powerfull this are never meant to be productive. They are geektoys, square and simple. You dont need 1,3Ghz chugging vista/XP to email, blog and type up some notes. Most people buy sports cars for the same reason. ;)
Productivity is in an eye of the beholder… or a Wibrain holder. ;)
I have a “normal”-sized notebook, Raon Everun Note and Wibrain B1, and most of the time when I’m on internet at home — I use Wibrain. It’s just so damn convenient… :)
I would never be content with a thumb based keyboard. I completely disagree with the last persons statement that they are never meant to be productive. While I would agree that most of the small computers today are not productive it is not due to the fact that they have small screens. To me it is due to not having a decent keyboard. I long ago also owned a Psion the Revo and I enjoyed typing with that computer and it was very productive. I did not like it due to the proprietary OS. If someone would finally make a MS Windows version that was the same size it would definately be productive! I used to type reports 1-8 pages all the time with it.
Al/Primaz
I’m done.
I just discoverd that you both are not just the same person that keeps repeating this argument on and on and on and on…… here and in Oqo Talk but that you are doing the same in Pocketables and I don’t know where else
I don’t know if you are doing it sincerelly or you are just trying to make noise.
If the rest of you believe I’m being rude, look at what is happening in Oqo Talk where he destroyed a couple of threads
http://www.oqotalk.com/index.php/topic,3683.0.html
Specially look at the last two pages
So I’m giving up following your comments
By
James88 = Adam = Marketingman = Al = Primaz? are you sure?
I’m reasonably sure about Al and Primaz (see he didn’t denie it) I should check the rest
Well I see now you probably were being ironic
But I’m sure about Al and Primaz
An OQO model 2+ with Mac OS X 10.5.6 (Leopard) inside would rock! Apple should buy OQO and make it the ultimate ultraportable Mac ever. Not to work on it, but for PowerPoint presentations. Just make the presentation on the Mac, save the NATIVE files to the OQO and then carry it and only it to the classroom, meeting or home for the full blown Keynote or PowerPoint presentation via videoprojector using NATIVE files.
Like I said before, put an ugly chewed apple sticker on it and it will sell alot better at this price then as a windows device, but not because of superior hardware or a better interface, but just because “its apple”. For example, theres tons of superior ipod clones out there for half the price, but people still zombie along with the apple crowd. :P Its almost considered a symbol of status to own something apple, id say.
I think there are some good points made above about whether you need higher resolution screens or whatever IN PRACTICE when using an OQO or anything else.
The problem is that we and they operate in a marketing led, looks led world. So if you have a high cost device sporting 800 x 480 BUT I can buy phones with that and their max price is about £550 and “apparently” less via a phone contract ie. £0 over 2 years – even if thats not strictly true its how Joe Bloggs sees it.
And as I’ve said many times UMPCs and especially premium ones ought to somehow provide a fully or semi integrated SIM/PHONE/VOICE solution. Even if they link a headset by Bluetooth and don’t have a phone’s receive in standby mode capability, it means you wouldn’t need to spend money on a handset, carry that too AND then sync all your contacts etc.
Actually now phones standardise on USB + BlueTooth for nearby connections it ought to be possible to insert a cheap phone module & sim into the umpc, cross connect to it via USB and have it talk directly to the headset. So it handles standby and calls and SMS, then give the UMPC a wake-on-phone/SMS option. The only extra engineering would be getting the phone module to implement mobile broadband for the UMPC half and maybe sharing the headset with the UMPC half. And as phone modules now handle WiFi & GPS too you could have having WiFi, BT, GPS, and mobile broadband implemented in the UMPC side.
Hmm. Must go and order a chinese phone and carve it up….!
I am not sure why would anyone decide to leave his cell at home and use a umpc to do his calls… It is not a bad idea to have this as an option but this is definitely not an important feature. HTC is doing this already with the Athena and nobody cares. These things are just too big to work as phones! Even if you use a headset you still have to carry them in your pocket. How comfortable would that be?
P.S. I don’t know if Primaz and whoever else is actually the same person – it doesn’t matter. It seems to me that many people here have a similar opinion with his, including me. OQO is going out of business and I thing is naive and very convenient to simply blame the economy for that. There must be something wrong with their product, don’t you think? Even if we do accept the premise that these are specialized devices targeted to specific groups of people like doctors and lawyers, reality doesn’t seem to agree. How many doctors and lawyers have you seen using the OQO? How many contracts does OQO have with the medical sector? They wouldn’t be close to bankruptcy if the had managed to penetrate any of these sectors.
Now before I hear again the argument that doctors are sheep and technophobic let’s please think for a second. Let’s say you need to run a very specialized application on a very small and light device. Is a 50-million-code line OS that doesn’t have a touchscreen GUI the appropriate tool to do so? Or is it more likely that you will do your job much better on a state-of-the-art mobile platform that is specifically designed for low power touchscreen devices?
You don’t want to run Vista on a tiny machine just to run a specialized application. You want Vista because you want to replicate your desktop experience as close as possible. If so, then you also need the appropriate input method to do it. And these kind of devices simply do not provide the appropriate input method!
Primaz is dead right, it is not the economy but the keyboard that killed OQO…
The point I was getting at is that Smartphones are growing in size in a kind of smartphone–>PDA–>MID evolution. And if you look at sales of iPhone and some of the HTC models people can be sold on them.
Then we have the netbook craze (finally cheap laptops not super desktops in a smallish box) and UMPC (generally too expensive for mass market and under marketed so Joe Bloggs doesn’t know why it might be useful and we can’t really say it would help him. The UMPCs generally have been too expensive for Joe Bloggs although oddly he’ll pay £500+ for an iPhone or HTC Touch HD.
My point was if you are paying £500+ for a fat smartphone its hard to get someone to even put a separate netbook in their briefcase. Why would most people want a second device at the max pocketable size?
My point about the phone/headset integration is it closes the GAP and you are on one device. And it has instant on for comms and standby for the rest. And as to headset + UMPC/Phone in the pocket, well Bluetooth is rated for 10 METRES (32 feet) so the UMPC cat sit where you like even in a briefcase UNTIL you need the screen/keypad/email. For most people it could sit on their desk and they could walk around the office. That’s why I like that concept so much “One Ring to Rule Them All”, plus an ear gadget and people like those. Blame Lt. Ahura.
To me smart phones, Pocket PC’s, Iphones, etc. have gotton more powerful and able to do simple computer functions where the limited thumb keys are acceptable. That basically kills the market for an expensive OQO that has the same type of limitations.
A PDA/phone though no matter the brand, etc. can only perform computer functions that are limited to viewing and very limited inputing of information. That is what UMPC’s have not realized nor have MIDS. Both have a very limited market and potential if they continue to replicate the same pen or thumb keys that the powerful phones have. What would make them very popular is if they find a way to perform the functions of a basic laptop yet are small enough to carry all the time.
I agree with others above that one such way they could do so is just update the popular handheld/clamshells we had in the Windows CE era but use the current UMPC technology. That would be a computer that I would buy and would justify a price up to what the OQO is charging. The reason for seeing it as a value is that if it had that design it would have a keyboard able to perform the more intensive computer tasks of a laptop. Yes it would be only for the ultra mobile but that market is very large.
Another option is to look at what UMPC’s tried to imply that they were origami like. Options that have multiple folds more than one could open the potential for larger keyboards and larger screens? I would be content with a simple handheld UMPC that I could type on but it would be a dream to have a real origami pocket laptop?
I agree that I would only want Vista if I could replicate my desktop experience so to me the problem with OQO is that their type of keyboard is just pointless to do real desktop type use. I do not know why people would try to say an OQO is practical at all? I do think the people whom said it would work with a larger keyboard so you could touch type are right. I think that type of computer could be still small enough for me to carry in my smallest purse or a man to carry in a typical suit pocket. Having a full PC any smaller like a shirt pocket is just not very useful.
I don’t understand you guys
Let’s say you like the Caravan but you think it consumes a lot of oil
Would you ask Crysler to make it more efficient or you would ask BMW to make the Mini cooper a little longer and to ad a third row of seats? Because to ask Oqo to be even a little bigger to accomodate a touchtype keyboard is crazy. It’s main goal is exactly it’s size (wich other) Who don’t need a device this size, shouldn’t look for an Oqo
Ask willcom or Wibrain or any other device that size to have a better keyboard, not Oqo.
I think why many have wanted to see OQO create a touch type keyboard version is that they were the first company that had the technology to finally create such a computer. When they first came out their marketing implied it was a pocket laptop/computer. Most people do want a pocket laptop but only if it follows the same way we use a laptop so most were dissapointed with the thumb keyboard. If OQO was smart they would have created a keyboard version as it only is in this last couple of years where others are close to catching up to OQO as far as making such a powerful PC so small.
I think OQO lacked the vision to do so even though they were the only ones positioned to create it. It is probably too late for them to realize their mistakes and finally make a product people would buy in numbers that would turn the company a profit. Their proposed 2+ model would definately not do very well since it uses the same poor thumb keys and the exact same exterior that created years ago.
New article: OQO seeks buyer. (Updated) http://cli.gs/yUGv9S
RT @chippy: New article: OQO seeks buyer. (Updated) http://cli.gs/yUGv9S
when mid producers/vendors were clever, they would throw into their package a pocketable keyboard (usb/bluetooth) as a free gadget. but no, these items are sold extra at exorbitant prizes too …. no wonder then.
I woulnd care for free keyboards and whatnot, since thats not what I buy MID/UMPC’s for. Thats what netbooks are for imho.
it’s not the question if you care or not … it’s nice to have on one side, would enhance the products value and clever marketing as well as coming in handy to pull over customers from netbooks.
Its indeed not wether I care or not. Its wether I want to pay for something I woulnd use. It might be called free, but to the customer it would still feel like they are paying extra.
Still I think it defies the point of buying a small pocketable device if including a keyboard matters to you.
You then own multiple PC’s right? Most people would not want to do so. That is why OQO and other UMPC’s have been doing poorly since their inception. People do want a pocket computer but only if they can use it the same way as any other desktop or laptop as they would expect it to be their sole PC.
Yes I do have a desktop machine, but you cant honestly say people buy a UMPC to be their sole means of computing? People who dont have a computer will buy something like a netbook. Geeks and people who cant drag around a bag all day and sync it up when they get home will grab at small devices like this.
Funny, no one has mentioned the quality of OQO products, specifically the model 2. It seems pretty standard that the sliders fail, and then warranty repairs take forever. It’s what kept me away from that model.
My OQO 01+ on the other hand, seems to be a tank. Still going strong, with all its warts: slow, hot, noisy and terrible battery life.
Hey, Chippy’s being quoted at Reg Hardware (via his Twittering).
http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/04/23/oqo_speculation/
QUOTE:
“The rumours appear to have started after a Twitterer called Chippy, who runs a UMPC-oriented blog, posted a message”. They give a link to your twittering rather than the portal.
oqo still havent got back to me. i can only assume that they have been told not to talk until they have worked out what to do. Its not looking good at all.
I’m not sure if this has been stated in this thread. (By the way this thread looks like one of the longest/intense threads)
But to me, the OQO has all design elements of the perfect UMPC. I still have not seen a UMPC that has all the elements of the OQO or Sony Vaio. Can fit in pocket, is very powerful (Vista/XP) has a keyboard and mouse pointer. How many UMPC’s can you fit into these catagories? Not many. wibrain, doesn’t fit in a pocket. Vilis S5 doesn’t have a keyboard or mouse. Umid M1 doesn’t have a mouse. Problem with Flip keyboards such has UMID M1. You need a flat surface to type. You can’t type while standing up. Which means you are subtracting mobility. I don’t believe people are complaining of the quality of OQO slide keyboard. At least it has one. Keyboard + plus mouse means you don’t have to remove/stop lift your fingers from the action, to perform more actions. That’s why a laptop’s mousePAD/eraser + keyboard maybe faster then mouse+keyboard. The only issue with OQO I see if no webcam. Which I think is important for mobile skyping/communications. (with 3g, why not have a webcam) OTher then that, all UMPC’s for the past 3 years are still catching up for the OQO’s and Vaio’s design. State one UMPC that is more MOBILE and POWERFUL as a OQO or Vaio. I don’t see any. Price is the only arguement. I think the price worth it for all it’s mobility qualities.
Only a tiny amount of people share your view as evident from the 8 years of OQO sales. The fact you are forgetting is that without a touch type keyboard most people will see an OQO not a computer that they would ever buy no matter how you improve the features. PC’s and PC software need a touch type keyboard period. What OQO should have done years ago is to change it to a longer clamshell so that a decent touch type keyboard could be built into it. Even if OQO by some miracle got some funding they would still eventually fail and go out of business if they continue to igmore the touch type keyboard. Their 2+ model would be a complete failure with very few buyer just like all of their previous models as they never change the basic design which is their key flaw.
I think oQo’s only missteps were:
* Not making the 02 passive/resistive touch
* Shacking up with VIA instead of Intel
* Not paying more attention to battery life & quality control
* EXPECTING THE BUSINESS SECTOR TO CARRY AND SUPPORT THEIR RIDICULOUS PRICES.
The oQo quite simply, is the epitome of a UMPC(imo).. small, stylish, usable, sturdy.. with better foresight by them, there should be NO reason why their device isnt lauded as much as say an iphone.
Wasted opportunity.
For a fraction of the price I would get a PDA phone or Iphone. UMPC’s have missed the point of a full PC. A full PC is useless with the type of input that the OQO provides. The market has made these facts loud and clear as OQO never sold many units so if you can not innovate then you should be extinct like the Dinasours.
Primaz.. you and your thousands of accounts need therapy.. why harp on oqo’s input choices? its fantastic and used in many other umpc/smartphone designs.. if you want a clamshell design BUY A CLAMSHELL DESIGN..
Obviously, someone who wants a physical keyboard will buy a blackberry, not an iphone..but I dont see them casting aspersions on iphone users.. just pointless and baseless.
oQo’s issues ran alot deeper than their friggin input choice.
winMo wont do what I want, and neighter will the iPhone.
And to be perfectly honest… I LOVE the oqo… in THEORY.
The slider screen with thumb board undernieth it, I love it!
(although I would have loved to see hardtop keys with press feedback rather then gummypad)
But its ugly flaws and higher then usuall price is what steered me away from it. The demons in its battery, the apparently flimzy slider mechanic, the outdated screen resolution, I think ive seen an abysmal service report or two, a price thats miles above its competitors, they all contribute to the OQOs demise.
Someone should pick this little missfit from the gutter and give it a good pollish. Stick with midrange hardware rather then try and beat sony, redesign a few small problems, and this little machine might verywell make a rocky II comeback. ;)
If you slap a Dell or HP on the front of the proposed 2+, workout battery issues, AND PROMOTE THESE DEVICES.. they will sellout in the U.S… all off the sudden outlets will discuss how much sense it makes to be able to have your desktop pc in the palm of your hands.. usable in grocery store lines and elevators..
The problem is not with oqo per se, but really all of these relatively unknown products with out big corporate backing..
IMO The UMPC breakthrough will come when the Nvidia Ion makes its debut, as that will bring these machines into the public conscious..recreation and aesthetics is paramount to americans.
You make a valid point in that most consumers are led by a mixture of marketing budget and brand recognition. Even on niche devices like UMPCs still seem to be. You can see the same with smartphones. O2 had Asus make them an xda model recently, its a hybrid of two Asus phones. On gsmarena the pure asus models get a much higher rating than the xda, and its the case+cpu of the lesser model and the specification (except cpu) of the better one. So brand perception is worth around 2/10 on the ratings ignoring the cpu performance costs. eg. http://www.gsmarena.com/compare.php3?idPhone2=2519&idPhone1=2594 and
http://www.gsmarena.com/compare.php3?idPhone2=2606&idPhone1=2594
I mention these a real world comparison. Brand Sells.
I think it is rather silly to think most people will want to do their desktop type computer work while standing? You use desktop software to do work not play games. OQO never could understand it and has failed.
I still have not seen a reply of a UMPC better designed/more mobile then the OQO. Arguments of the purpose/usability of an OQO is an argument againt UMPCs in general. Working while standing heck yeah. if you don’t understand that requirement you don’t understand a UMPC. and if you do need to work at a desk (full work mode) did you forget what a docking station is or a folding keyboard exists?? the whole point (in my mind) is to have a celll phone with desktop powers. so if you don’t think using a cell phone while standing is needed then you don’t know M means Mobile. I agree OQO price is high but its justified since no UMPC exists to date that is more capable/mobile/better designed then the OQO. I think perhaps the marketing could be an issue with the OQO’s success/demise. But why does umpcportal seem to not include the OQO as the standard reference measuring stick? OQO rarely exits in articles except when it is failing. I think the OQO should be in every article as the “IPOD like” reference system. nothing can beat the OQO in design. if there is a better designed UMPC please provide an example. (clamshells in my opinion are not as mobile since you really need a hard surface to work. and they look slightly weird while thumbing)
OQO has 8 years of marketing and attempts to gain interest in their design and it has not worked yet. The fact is that real Vista desktop programs are just not very useful with thumb input so people do not want to buy an OQO. No matter what they were to ever do in marketing would not change that basic fact. Technology will not change people’s behavior to go with something more difficult to use.
UMPC’s all have been a bit of a failure as UMPC’s yearly have had terrible sales in the 350K/year range worldwide including every brand. None of the UMPC’s inlcuding the OQO are very useful nor popular to most people so it would not be appropiate for umpcportal to ever use one as a benchmark to compare others.
While the few OQO owners love their OQO, the market has already spoken, most people do not share that view. Full Windows is meant to use a keyboard so most people would rather see a mobile UMPC with a touch type keyboard. If a clamshell pocket UMPC with a touch type keyboard were created it would sell very well.
“If a clamshell pocket UMPC with a touch type keyboard were created it would sell very well.” Well I woulnd want one for starters. Whats the point of buying an expencive miniature computer if you need a tabletop to use it properly.
What UMPC’s really need is a good shell. Desktop windows just isnt designed for small screens and touchscreens. A more UMPC oriented version of mediacenter would do alot nicer then a bare desktop enviorement. Linux with its many GUI’s could steal the market if it wasnt so incredibly pesky to install and maintain. Adobe Air could still provide a windows platform with a wonderfull GUI overlay though. (Viliv S5 is running its cube menu on it I believe)
Al I dissagree. Your second paragraph, to me, doesn’t quite make sense, and it disproves the UMPC market and this website. So unless you’re againt the UMPC market, you’re statement is incorrect. There is as market and interest for UMPC’s, that’s what this site is for.
touch screen and clamshell devices.
Touch screen, i think is a poor design for UMPC’s. Becuase if you notice a touch Screen keyboard takes up screen realestate, which is very valuable to a 5″ screen.
clamshell, I agree with Sokonomi, if you need a hard surface/tabletop to type, it’s not as portable. Remember how these mobile devices were called “Palm tops”, not “Desk tops” or “Lap tops”
The UMPC market not been very popular as the sales thus far have been very small even after all of this time. I do like the idea of a pocket size full PC computer but I just feel that so far all of the UMPC designs do not provide a touch type keyboard and that is what I and most others want out of a full PC computer. I would like to see a simple touch type clamshell full PC UMPC. A clamshell can be very portable as the old handhelds in the 1990’s proved that. They were about 7″ x 3.6″ x 1″ so they would easily fit in a jacket pocket. If you have a full PC OS and software they are not ideal to use those softwares without a touch type keyboard and are not the type of programs made for standing and using two thumbs to input. The reality is that most people do not want a full PC limited to thumb input.
I totally agrre with Phil. I would add that nobody says that the Oqo is a perfect design. It certainly can be improved. But I think that it’s design is the best up to date and that it should be a reference one.
BTW I’m not sure about that success in sales should be taken as a validation of a good design. I actually think, for example, that a Tesla is a far better car than any other and their poor sales doesn’t mean the opposite. Or, to give another example, the most succesfull pictures are not always the best ones, wright? So good sales doesn’t necessarilly imply a good UMPC design.
It just means its grocely overpriced for what it really is? ;-)
OQO has had 8 years to sell it and they still have yet to generate any real significant sales. The lack of a touch type keyboard reduces the value as it is thus not very functional as full PC software and OS is meant to be used with a keyboard. Thus it is a PC with a size and shape most people do not want to use nor buy. It is overpriced for that very reason as it is more of a toy as it can not be your only PC. Most people do not want multiple PC’s.
If it provided a touch type keyboard and was still small enough to fit in a jacket then it would be a good design and result in strong sales. OQO did not innovate and address the problem with their lack of a keyboard so they are going out of business.
Last response to Al. A Keyboard does exist on OQO. Touch screen and clamshell keyboards (IMO) are both poor designs for pocket sized devices. (5-7″) screens by reducing screen realestate, and reducing mobility. Al, please help include brighter discussion besides price and sales. I still think it would be interesting if someone can help provide a better designed UMPC example then the OQO.
To me the OQO’s thumb keys are not what I would call a normal keyboard. I do agree that pen input if that is what you mean by touch screen is also not ideal as the sole way to use a computer. It is nice to have so that in a small screen and computer you could use the touch screen in stead of a mouse.
For me I would like to see a clamshell computer that is about 7″ x 4″ x 1″ so that it is long enough for a decent touch type keyboard yet still slim enough to carry in a jacket pocket. If a UMPC had that size it would to me be better than an OQO as it would appeal to more people. It would be a computer that could actually replace a laptop for those highly mobile people whom do not want to lug a laptop around. One design back in the 90’s was the Psion 5mx; that type of keyboard is what I would recommend. That keyboard enabled me to type about 85% of desktop speeds as the keys were easy to feel. I would increase the size from 6.9″ long to say 7.4″ and increase the width from 3.6″ to 4″ and make it as slim as possible. That would provide a keyboard better than any computer ever made for such a pocketable small size.
i sent my oqo for repair in february and after multiple calls i have not got my machine back; i suspected that something was going on with these guys and it is not surprised that they are out-of-business….could you give some advice on how to have my oqo returned to me even if it is not fixed?
thanks,
try oqotalk.com I think they said that some ex OQO employees were going to help make repairs? I think they outsource the repairs and their message for sevice says they can not provide repairs at this time?
I think they are just about dead as I also read others saying that they drove by and found nobody home? If you can get it repaired great but it is probably time to start looking for a future replacement if I were you.
They really screwed themselves using the thumb keys like the old HP 200LX instead of modeling it using say an HP Jornada 720 type size computer. People just do not want a full PC without a keyboard.
thank you, james, for this info….
in the website that you mention, some people say that they got not only their machine back but also in working condition… i am still hopeful that they will send it to me.
And there you go again
James and AL. Just my opinion. But I think UMPC means Ultra “MOBILE” personal computer. IF you need to type at desktop speeds, UMPC’s are NOT designed for desktop typing speeds. I don’t see how you don’t understand typing speeds for UMPC will never match and were NEVER MEANT to match desktop typing speeds.
BUT if you open your minds a little, you can carry a full size foldable keyboard to meet that demand. This should answer your keyboard concerns for the last 100 posts. :)
Sad about OQO, have my 02 since April 2007, works great for on the go mobile computing, period. Between the thumb keyboard & track mouse, can do anything a laptop can with Windows Vista or XP plus tablet. Plus I can run almost any full-blown Windows software including MS Office & MS Visual Studio.
If I need to do some heads down typing or work, I can plug in or go wireless with a full size keyboard & mouse, plus plug into a full size monitor. Burns CD’s, haven’t tried DVD except watching a movie, hooked up my 02 to a projector and did a presentation at work. Also do the Internet via WiFi or my Sprint wireless broadband when out of WiFi range.
Perfect form factor for what it was designed for and it works great for me, barring a few improvements to its features the 02+ almost provided (would like higher native resolution), too bad we will not see it…